I am considering trying this with Nichole, but wanted to know if any of you give this to your kids, and if you do, what else do you give it with? How much, where do you get it, and do you see a difference?

Is this the same as Nutrivene and MSV?

_________________
Ellen, honored to be married to Andy since Feb 2003 and mom to Ellie (08/21/05) Nina (05/01/06 CP) and Nichole (10/02/07 DS)
www.elliestumbo.blogspot.com

"For you created my inmost being, you knit me together in my mother's womb. I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made, your works are wonderful, I know that full well." Psalm 139:13-14
God does not make mistakes

Bethany gives her girls Gingko...I just ordered some, myself, for Ethan. I got the honeycomb kind (per B's suggestion) from Amazon. It was cheaper through Amazon than Nutrivene.

_________________
Kristen: Wife to Scott, Mama Bear to Ethan
(05/25/01, DS & ALL)
Independent Demonstrator, Uppercase Living
http://kris10z.uppercaseliving.net

Forgive my ignorance - what do you use it for?

_________________
Karen xx
Mum to Edward (April 2006) & Alexander (DS - December 2008)

I will be watching this thread w/ much interest... Have been thinking of giving it to Jacey too. Does anyone know if you can give it if you are already doing the MSB or Nutrivene?? Anyone know the dosages??

_________________
Janet (44) and Jeff (44)
Joshua (angel) '85
Sarah-age 22
Jaret-age 5
Jacey-born 2/22/08 (dx w/ Ds 9/10/07)

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/ginkgo-biloba/NS_patient-ginkgo

I do not, but I have started occasionally taking it myself because I wanted to know the side effects first hand before I consider giving it to Violette.

The one thing that worries me is that if you are on Ginko, you have to be careful about surgery. I'd probably run the idea by your ped and any other "ologists" that your child sees before doing it!

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/ginkgo-biloba/NS_patient-ginkgo

Just something to think about!

_________________

I've been summoned. LOL. Thanks Kris. LOL.

Ok, so Nutrivene and MSB+ (not MSV) are NOT the same thing, but similar. We use Nutrivene. And neither of them are the same thing as Gingko. And yes, you can give Gingko while giving Nutrivene.

Use of Gingko in our kids (recommended after age 3 by Dr. Leichtman - others have given it sooner - his reasoning to wait is that Gingko has been shown to possibly have a link to febrile seizures, which are most common under age 3 - I guess?) is for speech ... and overall cognition, as far as I am concerned.

We use Honeycombs liquid with our girls. After giving it to them, I noticed an increase in speech and an increased attention span. Both of which - in the end - have to do with cognition.

Dosing is different based on the brand you get, and you also want to make sure you do not get a brand that has Gotu Kola in it for our kids (no, it is not always on the ingredient list, but I know Honeycombs does not have it).

Ellen, you asked what else we give it with. Here is our daily regime ...

Nutrivene daily supplement
Nutrivene nighttime formula
Gingko
DHA/Omega 3
Juice Plus
Vitamin D3

I don't think I'm forgetting anything...LOL. ?? I want to look into Piracetam and Circumin. Oh, and probiotics.

DOSING -- Ginkgo Biloba dosages have increased to 5.5 mg per kg (2.2 pounds) of body weight.

You need to figure out dosing based on the brand you buy and yes, there is a difference between extract and regular.

One dropper of Honeycombs is 80mg. And 1000mg of Ginkgo extract equals 80mg of gingko biloba.

And yes, you would need to stop the Gingko 2-3 days before surgery, because it can act as a blood thinning agent, which you do not want when having surgery.

_________________
Bethany, Mommy to Mason (6), Payton (4, DS) and Addison (3, DS)



Family blog:
http://thebalsisfamily.blogspot.com/

Adoption blog:
http://dreamingonanangel.blogspot.com/

Take control of your health with Juice Plus
www.livelife-juiceplus.com

lilpayton wrote:

Ellen, you asked what else we give it with. Here is our daily regime ... Nutrivene daily supplement Nutrivene nighttime formula Gingko DHA/Omega 3 Juice Plus Vitamin D3

I've been considering Juice Plus for Beth. You like it, Bethany? What differences if any do you see? Who do you get yours from? I met a very annoying rep at Circle of Support and I sure hope there are others out there. Please let me know (here or PM). Thanks!

Yes, we love it. My kids are really generally very healthy, and I think this is one reason why. My aunt and cousin are both reps actually ... they have been trying to talk me into it for ages but ...

A lot of what we use is for what it does on the inside ... you can't see that externally. But being healthy ... you can see and like I said, my kids are generally very healthy. My husband and I both take it too.

Let me know if you want to order ... I should just sign up already so I can get a discount. LOL.

_________________
Bethany, Mommy to Mason (6), Payton (4, DS) and Addison (3, DS)



Family blog:
http://thebalsisfamily.blogspot.com/

Adoption blog:
http://dreamingonanangel.blogspot.com/

Take control of your health with Juice Plus
www.livelife-juiceplus.com

Gingko is an herb that's been used for thousands of years in Asia for memory and cognitive skills. Eliza takes is and i do too. She uses the honeycombs too where i take the ginkgold pill - both are recommended brands. More info about what it does for the Ds mind specifically is at www.changingmindsfoundation.org

_________________
Liz - Mom to Walker (3/24/02), Eliza (Ds) (5/6/05), Alden Jane and Noah Henry (5/2/08 )

So where do you order or buy it??? What brand?

_________________
--Beth
Mom to Oliver, 5 (DS, ADHD)
and Sebastian, 4

EAS1971 wrote:

So where do you order or buy it??? What brand?

We just ordered the liquid Honeycombs Ginkgo Biloba from International Nutrition (www.nutrivene.com), but you can order it directly from the company (www.honeycombs.com). A health food store may carry it also or another online vitamin company.

We've also used the Nature's Way Ginkgold, but it's a pain to break the pills up.

Qadoshyah

_________________

Our Blog: http://gotdownsyndrome.blogspot.com

EAS1971 wrote:

So where do you order or buy it??? What brand?

I got the Honeycombs brand from Amazon for cheaper than Nutrivene's website and I bought 3 to save on shipping.

_________________
Kristen: Wife to Scott, Mama Bear to Ethan
(05/25/01, DS & ALL)
Independent Demonstrator, Uppercase Living
http://kris10z.uppercaseliving.net

kris10z wrote:

EAS1971 wrote: So where do you order or buy it??? What brand? I got the Honeycombs brand from Amazon for cheaper than Nutrivene's website and I bought 3 to save on shipping.

Cool!! Thanks for the tip.

_________________
--Beth
Mom to Oliver, 5 (DS, ADHD)
and Sebastian, 4

kris10z wrote:

EAS1971 wrote: So where do you order or buy it??? What brand? I got the Honeycombs brand from Amazon for cheaper than Nutrivene's website and I bought 3 to save on shipping.

Great tip!

Qadoshyah

_________________

Our Blog: http://gotdownsyndrome.blogspot.com

What are the side effects of taking this? Does it actually work?

_________________
Karen- Mum to the world's cutest baby!! Ben

Ciarras been on GB for about 4 yrs now. We use NOW brand capsules. You have to really research, make SURE the kind you use is standardized, you dont want too much ginkolic acid, its like poison ivy, same family. GB works. In my mind, it works without a single solitary doubt.

_________________

Michelle, Mom of KJnC
Kristin age 21
Jesse age 14
Ciarra age 11 (with DS)

ciarrasmom wrote:

Ciarras been on GB for about 4 yrs now. We use NOW brand capsules. You have to really research, make SURE the kind you use is standardized, you dont want too much ginkolic acid, its like poison ivy, same family. GB works. In my mind, it works without a single solitary doubt.

Chelle, did you see improvement in Ciarra's speech once she started on it? I know Ciarra's speech is very good, has it always been? Our doctor here said he would not do it, because it won't make a difference when she is 20 and he is skeptical. But he said we can do whatever we want to and he will support our decision.

_________________
Ellen, honored to be married to Andy since Feb 2003 and mom to Ellie (08/21/05) Nina (05/01/06 CP) and Nichole (10/02/07 DS)
www.elliestumbo.blogspot.com

"For you created my inmost being, you knit me together in my mother's womb. I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made, your works are wonderful, I know that full well." Psalm 139:13-14
God does not make mistakes

Ellen, for a kid who was already talking, it is more difficult to measure "success". BUT, I can tell you without question that it seemed to open up this deeper understanding of language for Ciarra. She took lesss time to respond when asked a question, it was as if the hesitation was gone, the thoughts came more quickly. and her language exploded. It was fuller, more deep, more rounded. I was a skeptic, but I changed my tune wuickly. I was stunned at how others noticed the same responses in their kids, it seems to affect speech most.
It is hard when your Dr says dont do something, and you really want to try. I do think some docs are hesitant to try anything new or even something that remotely looks like you are searching for a "cure". They dont want us to get our hopes up I think? I had tremendous doubts, but now I am a huge believer. Interestingly, Ciarra came off the GB last summer because we had concerns about a recurrent infection she was getting possibly being related to the gelatin the capsules are made of. We have since ruled that out, as shes still getting the infection. But the effects seem to have stayed with her, her language is pretty amazing. I posted in my "hi there" thread some videos that show progression of her speech, if you want to see what I mean. I do think there is room for improvement, but she is very well understood and has a tremendous vocabulary now.
Best of luck making this decision.

_________________

Michelle, Mom of KJnC
Kristin age 21
Jesse age 14
Ciarra age 11 (with DS)

I have actually bought some and it is sitting in my cabinet. My concerns are I can't find a definitive answer about how old a child has to be to take it. The nutrivene site says 3 and up. But when I emailed them, the response said it works best in school age kids. Lily is 3 1/2. She's a pretty good size. She about 30 pounds and 36 inches tall. I want to give it to her, but I'm worried about seizures. Does anyone know of any clear information on this?
Thanks,
Heather

_________________
Heather, mom to
Lily 7-27-06 DS AVSD repaired 11-28-06

I havent heard of any seizures so far, but it is so scary to jump in. I would say if you do decide to do this, start lowdose and work your way up to recommended dosage. Actually, it tastes pretty bad, so the kids may convince you to go slow all by their cute little selves. I was really grateful when C could swallow capsules. By the way, the liquid disguises really well in grape koolaid made strong.

_________________

Michelle, Mom of KJnC
Kristin age 21
Jesse age 14
Ciarra age 11 (with DS)

The only concern with seizures is in young children (under 3) only if they have had seizures before. It should be looked into/asked to your doctor, if your child has a seizure disorder. But, if the child is fine, then I wouldn't be too concerned. Particularly if they are over 2 years old. Some people have been using GB with kids under 2 years old, but there is not as much research and years of use in children under 2 years of age.

We use GB with Osiyyah (he just turned 5). We've been giving him the full recommended dosage for a little over a month. We had been giving him a smaller amount for the few years prior, only because of his age. Although, I would've started him on a higher dose of GB sooner had I thought about it.

One thing I have noticed is that any delayed response time that might be there is not there as much anymore at all. He used to say "huh" to a lot of things or statements we'd say to make sure that he was understanding us right. That has been WAY less the last couple weeks. He will still say it every now and then, but it's not near as often. Just an interesting observation .

Qadoshyah

_________________

Our Blog: http://gotdownsyndrome.blogspot.com

Qadoshyah, that quicker response time is something a LOT of people are seeing, almost as if the light clicks on faster once you start GB. That and the effects on speech are what I hear most. It is an interesting coincidence if it is one.

_________________

Michelle, Mom of KJnC
Kristin age 21
Jesse age 14
Ciarra age 11 (with DS)

Eliza is a talker but since the GB i feel cognatively her speech has gotten more mature and grammatically more complex. Who knows if it's the GB or just getting older, but i'm not stopping it The honeycombs brand tastes good to E. It's so easy to give her since she likes it.

_________________
Liz - Mom to Walker (3/24/02), Eliza (Ds) (5/6/05), Alden Jane and Noah Henry (5/2/08 )

this is a intresting thread. My only question is how do you manage to get your kid to take this stuff. I have had Anthony on Nutrivene but it is a struggle to get him to take the full dose everyday. I can put a little in every meal but if I put too much he won't eat it. I sure wish it came in some other form then power.

_________________
Whife to Sergei and Mom to Alexander (8/7/99), Andrew (9/26/02), Anthony (12/29/05 DS)
[img]

The honeycombs brand (supposedly tastes honey like) is a liquid that i just squirt the dropper in Eliza's mouth each morning. This is a girl who can find nutravene in anything. She takes the GB no problem at all.

_________________
Liz - Mom to Walker (3/24/02), Eliza (Ds) (5/6/05), Alden Jane and Noah Henry (5/2/08 )

I don't mean to be a trouble maker....really. I would just like to hear any arguements against gingko. I know there were some possible negative things about it (other than the blood thinning effect) but I can't remember.

_________________
Alicia
Mom to: Christopher - 23 years old
Dex - 21 years old
Lierin - 21 years old
Kayla - 9/6/05 (DS)
Braden- 9/11/07

thanks I just learned something new tongith. I will have to try the Honeycomb formula. I sure am sturggling with Nutrivene. I don't know if i would do anything more then a multi-vitiame formula. I need to read more .

_________________
Whife to Sergei and Mom to Alexander (8/7/99), Andrew (9/26/02), Anthony (12/29/05 DS)
[img]

This is very interesting. Speech being E's biggest delay. ( actually we are seeing big improvements since his tubes) i'm gonna look into this. he'll be 3 in oct

_________________
Dawn
SAHM 2 Alex (5), Eian (2 DS) & Will (4/9/10)http://mamamonkmee.blogspot.com/

Alicia wrote:

I don't mean to be a trouble maker....really. I would just like to hear any arguements against gingko. I know there were some possible negative things about it (other than the blood thinning effect) but I can't remember.

Alicia, we don't give gingko to Oliver yet, but we'll probably start sometime soon. I had some concerns and asked my sister's friend, who happens to run a DS/Alzheimers clinic, her opinion.

Quoting her answer:

Quote:

Gingko: This is a toss up. Some studies indicate it might be helpful in preventing cognitive decline and others don't. It's not that this medication is not without side effects as there is an increased risk of bleeding with it. We don't routinely recommend its use in clinic but I don't discourage someone from using it if they are already on it.

The bleeding issue and possible seizures are the only concerns I've ever heard. And with the seizures, as I understand it, it's exactly as Kokiechick stated:

Quote:

The only concern with seizures is in young children (under 3) only if they have had seizures before. It should be looked into/asked to your doctor, if your child has a seizure disorder.

_________________
--Beth
Mom to Oliver, 5 (DS, ADHD)
and Sebastian, 4

In consulting with a couple doctors and an herbalist the negatives are 1) could exacerabate a pre-existing seizure disorder 2) Thins blood so if you child is on a blood thinner already or asparin protocal then don't use it. 3) It may not really do anything so you are wasting money.

This isn't a new thing. It's been used in Asia for thousands of years. The one thing i will say is i give it to Eliza in the mornings because i think it has had an affect on her sleep if i've given it to her later.

_________________
Liz - Mom to Walker (3/24/02), Eliza (Ds) (5/6/05), Alden Jane and Noah Henry (5/2/08 )

ciarrasmom wrote:

Qadoshyah, that quicker response time is something a LOT of people are seeing, almost as if the light clicks on faster once you start GB. That and the effects on speech are what I hear most. It is an interesting coincidence if it is one.

Yeah, we've only been on the full dose for about 4-5 weeks, so I'm curious to see how things continue to go and what more we may see.

I'm definitely curious if we will see anymore explosions with his speech too. His speech exploded when we started giving him Longvida Curcumin back in May '09. So, I wonder how much more will come of it.

Anyone who wants to know more about Longvida Curcumin, I'd be glad to make a new topic on it. We've seen major changes in Osiyyah's speech with it and there are lots of others who have seen the same changes in their children.

Qadoshyah

_________________

Our Blog: http://gotdownsyndrome.blogspot.com

Kokie
Love if you could start a new topic on Longvida! I just bought some but haen't started giving it to Eliza.

_________________
Liz - Mom to Walker (3/24/02), Eliza (Ds) (5/6/05), Alden Jane and Noah Henry (5/2/08 )

These topics exhaust me. We use gingko. We saw improvements. The blood thing is really only an issue for surgery, which is why you stop the gingko a few days before surgery and then resume it after. We also use Nutrivene. You need to research what is going on inside your child's body and how to help that. IMO, a flintstone ain't gonna cut it. I also want to look into Circumin ... saving that for my next 5 minutes of free time. LOL.

_________________
Bethany, Mommy to Mason (6), Payton (4, DS) and Addison (3, DS)



Family blog:
http://thebalsisfamily.blogspot.com/

Adoption blog:
http://dreamingonanangel.blogspot.com/

Take control of your health with Juice Plus
www.livelife-juiceplus.com

We started Lucy on ginkgo a couple of months ago. Anyone who follows my blog knows that she's been absolutely on fire recently. I can't say that it is definitely the GB or if it's just a huge coincidence in timing, but what we're seeing here is astounding.

Her receptive language is unbelievable. She can follow two step directions. Her attention and ability to focus are also significantly increased. She (as some of you saw in the video I posted in the brags section) will sit and do multiple puzzles for a long period of time. (The video was 15 minutes long.) Her expressive language and signing have exploded. More than even her production, though, is her obvious desire to learn. She is completely obsessed with signing DVDs...Signing Time, Baby Einstein, it doesn't matter. It's like she is thirsting for it.

Like I said, I don't know if it is her age or the ginkgo, but it's an amazing coincidence if that's all it is.

_________________
~Courtney
{Lucy, 3, Ds, AVSD repaired 1/08; Brodie, 1}

Friendship is born at that moment when one person says to another, "What! You too? I thought I was the only one!" -CS Lewis

Courtney, That is awesome news about Lucy! We bought the Honeycombs GB and I researched the dose and when we started Lucas on it, he started having very loose stools (which seems to be a side effect) so we stopped it -- we're going to restart him on a smaller dose but just wanted to check to see what amount your giving Lucy and if you started her with a lower dose. Any other ideas for when/how to give it would be appreciated too!

Here's to continued success for Lucy!

_________________
Sandy, momma to Lucas "the bean" (10/15/06)

Sandy ... how much are you giving him and how much does he weigh?

_________________
Bethany, Mommy to Mason (6), Payton (4, DS) and Addison (3, DS)



Family blog:
http://thebalsisfamily.blogspot.com/

Adoption blog:
http://dreamingonanangel.blogspot.com/

Take control of your health with Juice Plus
www.livelife-juiceplus.com

I researched the Changing Minds Foundation dosage which says it's suppose to be 2.5 mg per lb. so I gave him 80 mg or a dropper full of the Honeycombs -- he weighs 34 lbs. Please let me know your thoughts about that and your experiences with the girls. Thanks, Bethany!

_________________
Sandy, momma to Lucas "the bean" (10/15/06)

Hi everyone,

Just a lurker here but wanted some help I you wouldn't mind. My son with DS just turned 8. I'd love to start him on GB because speech is his big delay. I bought the recommended Honeycombs Ginkgo Biloba Extract but am not sure about the dosage. On the bottle it says 1/2 a dropper = 500mg. Isn't that too much based on what I read here:
2.5mg/1 lb body weight? MY son weighs 54lbs.

I'd appreciate any help because doing this makes me so nervous that I'm giving him too much.

Thanks...Patty

_________________
Patty

Lucas and Justin (DS

1,000 mg Ginkgo Biloba Extract is equivalent to 80 mg of Ginkgo Biloba

_________________
Liz - Mom to Walker (3/24/02), Eliza (Ds) (5/6/05), Alden Jane and Noah Henry (5/2/08 )

I'm going to check it out.

There's several OTC's that thin the blood and need to be stopped prior to surgery, including vitamin E and Baby Aspirin. I wouldn't worry about the Gingko if you follow dosing and include it on a list of meds when you go to the doctor. Usually to be cautious, they ask that supplements be stopped a week before surgery. If there was an emergency surgery than you would tell them all OTC's as well as prescribed meds and they can check clotting times so they know what to expect. I'm with Bethany on this, I wouldn't sweat the blood thinner part more than I would with any other supplement - that's part of what gets you get the desired effect!

_________________
Anara
Wife to Craig (wed 3.8.03)
Mom to Clara (DS, Autism, born 8.8.05), Alan Russell (born 3.9.07)

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